INTERVIEW

Bishop Macram Gassis of Sudan Urges Compassion and Love

CBN.com – (CBN News) - For the past 22 years, the Arab Muslim north waged a bloody battle with the mainly black Christian and animist south.

Christian families were torn apart as family members were sold in to slavery, children were forced to become child soldiers, and more than two million people have died in the conflict.

But since the peace accords were signed earlier this year, an uneasy peace now spreads across most of the country. It is time to begin rebuilding lives.

But even as peace is restored in the south, international attention turns to the western province of Darfur.

The Sudanese government is accused of carrying out a deliberate ethnic cleansing of the black Muslims. Thousands have died in Darfur in the past two years.

Many of those who are able to escape, have flooded across the border into southern Sudan, a region already weakened by the war with the north.

The Diocese of Bishop Macram Max Gassis cuts a swath right through the central part of Sudan. It goes deep into Darfur, and into the hotly contested Nuba Mountain region.

Gassis says, "These are human beings destroyed by the war, traumatized by the war, forgotten by the international community…are they also going to be forgotten by the church?"

So he is helping to lead the charge to bring aid to refugees from Darfur and rebuild the ravaged south of Sudan.

The Catholic Diocese of Sudan is drilling wells for clean water, building schools and provides medical care, bringing hope to the bruised and battered people of Sudan.

Gordon Robertson recently sat down with Sudanese Bishop Macram Max Gassis to discuss the ongoing violence gripping his nation and how he believes a peaceful solution can be achieved.

GORDON ROBERTSON: Joining us now to tell us about the struggles of his country is Bishop Gassis of the Catholic Diocese of Sudan. Bishop Gassis, welcome to “The 700 Club."

BISHOP MARCAM MAX GASSIS: Thank you.

ROBERTSON: This conflict seems to have been going on almost forever. Get us into it. What is the root cause of what is going on right now?

GASSIS: The root cause is diversity in Sudan - of ethnic groups, cultures, politicians, and the diversity of creed. I think that diversity does not impoverish a nation. Diversity enriches a nation, and you have this here in the United States, and Canada, and other places. But it seems that we are not ready to accept diversity. Yet God created us diverse, but united together through love.

ROBERTSON: From your standpoint, it is more than just Muslim-Christian - Muslim north, Christian south, but there’s also Muslim against Muslim, based on tribal differences. Is there any sort of solution that you see in the near term, or is it just a long term? Can we come to enlightenment on this issue of diversity so that we can all live together in Sudan in peace?

GASSIS: I believe it is through educational information. It is a reality of growth. We have to grow. And here the role of the church is very important. The church should help the people to accept diversity. The church should help the people to accept each other as brothers and sisters, coming from the same source and going back to the same source. And this will take time. You cannot build a nation on tribalism. You cannot build a nation on ethnic wars and ethnic hatred. This is impossible. We will never reach maturity that way. For me, it is a process and the role of the church is very vital to help the government understand, accept, and implement this diversity.

ROBERTSON: Is that going to be possible within…you know, I see that belief within the Christian faith, and I adhere to it - but how does that translate to a Muslim faith, where it seems they are bent on jihad against the infidel? Is it translatable into the faith of Islam?

GASSIS: It is through enlightenment, education, and dialogue. I would like to clarify the word dialogue. Nobody so far gave me a satisfactory definition of dialogue. Yet, people point their fingers at us, the leaders in the church, [and say] you must dialogue. I tell them, give me the definition of dialogue. And they are not able to give me a definition of dialogue. According to me, dialogue is acceptance of each other. The reciprocal respect for each other – it is a living dialogue.

When I have a school, whether I have a thousand students, and I have Christians, Muslim, and African of traditional belief - this is dialogue. When I drill wells, the water that comes out, it's not Catholic, it is not Christian - the water is for everybody. This is dialogue. Christians and Muslim and Africans of tradition are going to drink from the same source and the same well. When I make a hospital or a maternity, it is not reserved for Christian mothers, it is for everybody. This is what I call living dialogue. This here, we send a message of our creed, our faith is love in action. And that will help them.

ROBERTSON: How have you personally done this? I know, because you testified in front of the U.S. Congress about the atrocities going on in Sudan, that there was a criminal warrant for your arrest, and you are now technically a refugee of your own country. That, if you go back to Sudan, you will face a trial, possibly execution, possibly imprisonment. How did that relate to you personally? Have you found that there is dialogue, or is there just the government way and no other way?

GASSIS: When I put it to practice in the Nuba mountains, people think that I am completely outside my country, you know – 100 percent refugee. I am not. I venture to go to the Nuba mountains notwithstanding that the Khartoum government put sanctions on anyone who goes to the Nuba mountains. Even the United Nations was not able to go to the Nuba mountains. The NGOs (private organizations that perform humanitarian services) could not manage to go there until the signing of the cease-fire for the Nuba mountains, which took place in Switzerland. Then the NGOs started to come. But I went, even before that. We were bombed, we were shelled. My workers went there, and we took the risk. Yes, I was a bad man to the government for all of these years, but after the peace agreement, comprehensive peace agreement, I go back.

I go back because I wasn’t holding any gun, I wasn’t fighting with bullets. I was not aspiring for any political post or prestige. I was standing up for the dignity of people, for people. I do not say for Christians - for people. As Mother Teresa said, a sick person has no color, religion, or tribe. He is God's child. And that's what really, you know, gave me the power to go and take the risk. When people say, but bishop, why are you taking the risk? Why do you put your life in jeopardy? And I always reply, anybody who is in love is crazy. Even Jesus on the cross. Out of love.

ROBERTSON: That's great. What would you ask people watching the show today? What would you ask them to do? I know you've encouraged the U.S. Congress to take action. I know you've encouraged the UN to take action. What would you want people to do for Sudan today?

GASSIS: To reject, totally and completely, the expressions “compassion fatigue” and “donation fatigue.” If I am a true Christian who is to share whatever I have - freely you receive, freely you give. There is no space for donation fatigue, and no space for compassion fatigue. Love should never become tired. Love is a dynamic reality that grows. If it doesn't grow, it dies. The second thing is, we are facing now - the churches are facing - a population that is traumatized by war. The after-war situation is a dramatic reality for us. It is frightening. People are accustomed to force, to violence. The beautiful extended African family, the real fabric of the African family, is destroyed by war.

So youth are accustomed to take everything by the gun. AIDS is coming to the country - HIV-AIDS. And my slogan today is, let us speak to the pieces. Not to the walls, concrete and roof, but to human pieces that need to be rebuilt. It is very easy to destroy, but it is very difficult to build and re-build.

ROBERTSON: Thank you for being with us. That was a great message. I couldn't have said it better. Don't get compassion fatigue. Yes, the problems seem insurmountable in Sudan, but at the same time, the love of Christ can break through. Love never fails, that's what the Bible said. Love never fails. Let us reach out with hands of compassion and love regardless of religion and ethnicity. They are sick and need our help. Bishop, God bless you.

GASSIS: God bless you.

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